The Soapbox

tchoo

Joined: 12/11/2002 Posts: 1440
Likes: 1853


It was partially a joke


There obviously arent enough private roads. Also, I have no problem with roads, schools, medicare and social security. I also dont have an issue with being angry that people are on government dole. My problem is that people demonize "welfare" recipients as if they are any different than a large swath of SS and Medicare recipients. The fact is, we don't know how much they have paid in taxes in they have been here and taxes fund TANF and WIC and EITC. So if you are going to say "this person is on TANF and sucks", you should also look at in the mirror and say "hmm how much did I pay into SS and how much have I gotten so far", because given the demographics of people that are most likely to say "this person on TANF sucks", its likely you are both net takers.

See below for my rationale for why Medicare/Social Security is welfare.

Medicare/Social Security are welfare for old people that are packaged in such a way that old people can sleep at night knowing "they paid in" since there are specific taxes collected for the benefit and you have to work for a certain amount of years to "earn it". While its great that they paid in and they worked for 10 years, their benefit is not directly linked to the taxes they have paid. Further, the taxes they have paid in total are no where near enough to pay for all of their benefits. If you could prove to me that the amounts paid in by each year of retiree=the amounts received by each year of retiree (i.e. for all of the people that started collecting SS in 1988, they paid in X collectively and received benefits of X collectively), they I would buy that it is just a redistribution of amounts people paid in. But you cant prove that, because beneficiaries are getting more than they paid in (other than rich people, who probably pay in more than they receive or people who die young). Not only that, the 10 year work requirement and the tax are completely arbitrary #s. If the government changed the program and said "you work for 1 year and pay taxes for that year and you will get $5K for the rest of your life", would you say that you "paid in"? I assume no, but given my experience with a fair amount of people currently on SS/Medicare, they would do whatever mental gymnastics are required to say that they arent on welfare.

To further establish my POV, I will link to a conservative think tank website (for the record, I disagree with the reason they wrote the article, but I agree with the conclusion).

https://www.fff.org/explore-freedom/article/is-social-security-welfare/

On the public schools, there is nothing in the constitution that guarantees an education (as far as I know). Further, if I send my kid to a private school and continue to pay all of my state and property taxes, I am paying for a service provided by the government and not using it. How is this any different that "welfare"? I pay taxes, the government takes those taxes and provides social services (e.g. schools, welfare, roads, police, fire etc.). If I don't partake in those social services, I am effectively providing welfare to everyone else.

Lastly, if the issue is, we need to stop taking in immigrants because they are net takers, I think you have to look at more long run statistics.


(In response to this post by BocaHoo91)

Posted: 12/06/2018 at 08:58AM



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Current Thread:
 
  
US Census confirms: 70% of immigrants on the dole -- MasterRusty 12/05/2018 1:35PM
  Hopefully someone below informed you that your -- 111Balz 12/05/2018 8:13PM
  What is the expanded definition of -- BocaHoo91 12/05/2018 10:41PM
  More like 95%. High earners more than -- BocaHoo91 12/06/2018 12:58AM
  They might even have kids who go to public school -- WahooMatt05 12/05/2018 4:23PM
  Prolly also drive on roads!!!! -- tchoo 12/05/2018 8:24PM
  It was partially a joke -- tchoo 12/06/2018 08:58AM
  Couple of follow-ups -- tchoo 12/06/2018 11:57AM
  So its at least 15% welfare? -- tchoo 12/06/2018 1:42PM
  Agreed ** -- tchoo 12/06/2018 10:54AM
  Exactly! why stop there? ** -- HokieDan95 12/05/2018 4:17PM
  A system most paid into. ** -- Cold Hoober Hoo 12/05/2018 3:57PM
  Compared to 35% native born -- TomKazanski 12/05/2018 2:37PM
  Hey Tommy, now that you're back ... -- Beerman 12/05/2018 2:53PM
  Ballot harvesting? lol ** -- Beerman 12/05/2018 3:11PM
  I don't doubt it -- Beerman 12/05/2018 1:58PM
  ...today -- Beerman 12/05/2018 2:00PM
  It’s an endless cycle with chain migration -- TomKazanski 12/05/2018 2:36PM
  I mean, that's how our country was born ... -- Beerman 12/05/2018 2:51PM
  You have yet to make an argument for why we need them -- TomKazanski 12/05/2018 3:13PM
  Because they make America great (edited) -- Beerman 12/05/2018 3:30PM
  Very RACIST of you. ** -- MasterRusty 12/06/2018 4:18PM
  A prosperous economy is a growing economy -- Beerman 12/05/2018 3:58PM
  (link) -- hooshouse 12/05/2018 1:48PM
  No link for her accusations. ** -- MasterRusty 12/05/2018 1:54PM
  LOL - asking for assistance? ** -- Guy LeDouche 12/05/2018 2:08PM
  (link) -- hooshouse 12/05/2018 1:57PM
  From the article..... -- MasterRusty 12/05/2018 1:58PM
  No they oppose it for people who should be getting it -- TomKazanski 12/05/2018 2:39PM
  How so ? I want to explain that to my 93 yo dad ** -- NewBernHoo 12/05/2018 9:32PM
  It certainly was. Now we design policy for the 1%. ** -- Seattle .Hoo 12/05/2018 2:38PM
  ... -- hooshouse 12/05/2018 2:02PM
  Giving people benefits for 10+ years? -- MasterRusty 12/05/2018 1:57PM
  And they generally are not. ** -- Seattle .Hoo 12/05/2018 2:00PM
  Seems to me like we need to take in more. -- Hokieesith 12/05/2018 1:37PM

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