The Soapbox

Joined: 09/19/2008 Posts: 3846
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The US version of democracy has always been binary

I agree with you that it's not a great way to run things, but that's how our elections work. We don't form coalition governments in Congress. Never have. From my perspective, the first step to breaking the two party hold on our system of government is to run candidates in state legislatures and for House seats that actually have a chance of winning as 3rd party candidates. If you win enough seats in a legislature or the House, then you get to play kingmaker in a coalition. That will require a ton of money and infrastructure, but not as much as you would need to win an election for President as a 3rd party.

This year, either Trump or Biden will be elected President for the next 4 years. What did voting for Jill Stein or Gary Johnson get anybody in 2016? If they favored Trump over Clinton but didn't want to hold their nose and vote for him, they got the outcome that was less bad in their minds. Then they probably voted for Trump in 2020. If they hated Trump but didn't want to say they voted for Clinton after she won, they got a rude surprise on election night and four years of a President they didn't want. Then they got to vote for Biden in 2020. That was the Never Trump crowd last time around. I was in that group, but knew the logical extension of Never Trump was voting for Clinton.
[Post edited by CMUHoo at 04/10/2024 1:05PM]

(In response to this post by Hooooooooooooooo)

Posted: 04/10/2024 at 1:03PM

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Current Thread:

Just to remove any doubts about RFK's role in the race, here's the NY Times -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 10:59AM

This is one where I can't help but think "Let he who is without sin cast -- Late 80s Hokie 04/10/2024 2:36PM

Maybe they think increased support will come from Biden's voters, but the -- CharlestonSC 04/10/2024 1:39PM

I'm not sure he will pull more votes away from Biden vs Trump. His anti-vax -- JohnHoo2 04/10/2024 11:57AM

Anti-vax is an OG granola lefty thing -- CharlestonSC 04/10/2024 1:40PM

Historically yes -- always appealed to margins on all sides -- fishhoo 04/10/2024 2:03PM

Definitely. When I first encountered vaccine skepticism about 20 or so -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 1:47PM

Agree - RFK Jr. has views on a range of topics, but by a giant margin -- fishhoo 04/10/2024 12:49PM

There are probably millions of hold your nose and vote for Trump people -- Capital City Hoo 04/10/2024 12:41PM

The question is, is RFK, Jr. smart enough to realize this, and if so, does -- Hoo TV 04/10/2024 11:27AM

Straight from the ''No shit sherlock scandal files'' ** -- HokieDan95 04/10/2024 11:15AM

It might work better than trying to get Kanye West to run, right? ** -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 11:28AM

RFK, Jr is allowing himself to be manipulated. No idea why. ** -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 11:04AM

He's always been nuts, anti-vax, and prone to conspiracy theory BS -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 11:05AM

He’s a Democrat. Always has been, always will be. ** -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 11:24AM

Which is why he will tug away some votes from confused Democrats. -- Newt 04/10/2024 6:36PM

Running as an independent, shunned by the Kennedy family, and backed by -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 11:26AM

He’s running as an independent only because the… -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 11:43AM

No, he was running in the primaries as a Democrat and gained no traction -- Chuck Taylor 04/10/2024 11:54AM

How was he prohibited? ** -- SixerHoo 04/10/2024 11:50AM

"poster child for Dem Party nuttery" who is viewed favorably by GOPers -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 11:50AM

Kennedy got the COVID shots right along with… -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 12:46PM

And that disproves my point how exactly? ** -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 12:54PM

My point is that he always has been and still is a Democrat. The… -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 1:05PM

Not correct with the vaccine description-by a giant margin, his dedication -- fishhoo 04/10/2024 1:16PM

Yes — I’m aware. That’s what I was… -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 2:39PM

Then I misread your post which sounded like you saying his vaccine focus -- fishhoo 04/10/2024 2:57PM

No, I meant he and the right aligned on the COVID shots. To my knowledge…. -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 4:27PM

Uh no, at least not as far as Trump goes -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 4:49PM

His next most prominent current position is on Russia, where he also -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 1:12PM

“Crazy wing”. Oh, yes, the wing that… -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 1:20PM

Actually the traitorous wing. -- Chuck Taylor 04/10/2024 1:26PM

Are Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger Republicans in your mind? ** -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 1:22PM

Nominally, yes. Uniparty wing. ** -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 1:36PM

Calling it an insurrection is thus not exclusively a Dem thing -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 2:08PM

For future reference when I post, when I refer to… -- Los Angeles Hoo 04/10/2024 2:45PM

That important piece of information is duly noted. -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 3:43PM

Wouldn't that then suggest he's more likely to take votes from Trump than -- Hoodafan 04/10/2024 11:58AM

Don't think that follows -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 12:07PM

Wow.wasting your vote by continuing to vote for the two selected candidates -- Hooooooooooooooo 04/10/2024 12:54PM

Our system is the worst of all……………………….. -- Chuck Taylor 04/10/2024 1:22PM

There's a lot to question about that right now, Chuck. The United States is -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 1:41PM

Sure, I didn't bother for specifics, just commenting on the basic structure -- Chuck Taylor 04/10/2024 2:55PM

If you want a parliamentary democracy there are several to choose from. -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 1:21PM

You are saying that voting for any party other than reps/dems is a waste of -- Hooooooooooooooo 04/11/2024 10:18AM

The US version of democracy has always been binary -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 1:03PM

Yeah, I think you're probably right, that Trump's voters are more solid, -- Hoodafan 04/10/2024 12:31PM

As a former conservative, I agree with your take on RFK in paragraph 2 -- CMUHoo 04/10/2024 12:52PM

I think Trump's vote is more committed but smaller than last time. ** -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 12:44PM

He actually might. Be careful what you wish for. ** -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 12:02PM

You misspelled "lunatic." -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 11:25AM

His running mate Nicole Shanahan seems like a piece of work. Smart enough -- Seattle .Hoo 04/10/2024 11:18AM